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	<title>Comments on: Wiretapping, Telecom Companies, and You</title>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-612</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jun 2008 14:32:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-612</guid>
		<description>Wired has a post at Threat Level today.  Not only is the NSA breaking the law to spy on Americans, they&#039;re illegally spying on the wrong people.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/06/mobile-phone-nu.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/06/mobile-phone-nu.html&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wired has a post at Threat Level today.  Not only is the NSA breaking the law to spy on Americans, they&#8217;re illegally spying on the wrong people.</p>
<p><a href="http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/06/mobile-phone-nu.html" rel="nofollow">http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/06/mobile-phone-nu.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-229</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Mar 2008 19:29:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-229</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.speaker.gov/blog/?p=1216&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;FISA revision passes the house&lt;/a&gt; with NO immunity for telecoms.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.speaker.gov/blog/?p=1216" rel="nofollow">FISA revision passes the house</a> with NO immunity for telecoms.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-215</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:56:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-215</guid>
		<description>TC said: 
&lt;blockquote&gt;The potential law suits ... would bankrupt these telecommunication companies. That would result in thousands having to find new work, destroying millions, if not billions, in investor value and potentially wreaking havoc on our telec. infrastructure.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Cry me a river.  If we let companies break the law becuase Wall Street rewards it, why bother pretending that we have any law in the first place?  

WSJ ran a big expose on the NSA data-hoover project yesterday.  You can read it here:  http://online.wsj.com/public/article_print/SB120511973377523845.html

&lt;blockquote&gt;According to current and former intelligence officials, the spy agency now monitors huge volumes of records of domestic emails and Internet searches as well as bank transfers, credit-card transactions, travel and telephone records. The NSA receives this so-called &quot;transactional&quot; data from other agencies or private companies, and its sophisticated software programs analyze the various transactions for suspicious patterns. Then they spit out leads to be explored by counterterrorism programs across the U.S. government, such as the NSA&#039;s own Terrorist Surveillance Program, formed to intercept phone calls and emails between the U.S. and overseas without a judge&#039;s approval when a link to al Qaeda is suspected.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Your own government is spying on you.  Spying on me.  They&#039;re breaking the law.  And you expect me to feel sorry for the schmucks at AT&amp;T who are helping them get away with it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TC said: </p>
<blockquote><p>The potential law suits &#8230; would bankrupt these telecommunication companies. That would result in thousands having to find new work, destroying millions, if not billions, in investor value and potentially wreaking havoc on our telec. infrastructure.</p></blockquote>
<p>Cry me a river.  If we let companies break the law becuase Wall Street rewards it, why bother pretending that we have any law in the first place?  </p>
<p>WSJ ran a big expose on the NSA data-hoover project yesterday.  You can read it here:  <a href="http://online.wsj.com/public/article_print/SB120511973377523845.html" rel="nofollow">http://online.wsj.com/public/article_print/SB120511973377523845.html</a></p>
<blockquote><p>According to current and former intelligence officials, the spy agency now monitors huge volumes of records of domestic emails and Internet searches as well as bank transfers, credit-card transactions, travel and telephone records. The NSA receives this so-called &#8220;transactional&#8221; data from other agencies or private companies, and its sophisticated software programs analyze the various transactions for suspicious patterns. Then they spit out leads to be explored by counterterrorism programs across the U.S. government, such as the NSA&#8217;s own Terrorist Surveillance Program, formed to intercept phone calls and emails between the U.S. and overseas without a judge&#8217;s approval when a link to al Qaeda is suspected.</p></blockquote>
<p>Your own government is spying on you.  Spying on me.  They&#8217;re breaking the law.  And you expect me to feel sorry for the schmucks at AT&amp;T who are helping them get away with it?</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Manchester</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-203</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Manchester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 18:23:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-203</guid>
		<description>I collected quite a few widely scattered pdf documents on this subject starting in January 2005 when the House Judiciary Democrats had a briefing on this, and converted them to HTML with links to citations, court precedents, etc.

The Hepting and ACLU complaints are there, along with congressional testimony, issues briefings, items from the Center for National Security Studies, Morton Halperin, the ABA, and a couple of articles I wrote bundled with other coverage from National Journal (Shane Harris), MSNBC and USA Today.  There are also a couple of important Congressional Research Service reports as well.

File links are all filenames only (relative links), so you can download and unzip into any directory for local or lan use.

The collection is here:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://thewall.civiblog.org/rsf/nsa.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;thewall.civiblog.org/rsf/nsa.html&lt;/a&gt;

I hope You find this collection useful.

Cheers,

  -dcm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I collected quite a few widely scattered pdf documents on this subject starting in January 2005 when the House Judiciary Democrats had a briefing on this, and converted them to HTML with links to citations, court precedents, etc.</p>
<p>The Hepting and ACLU complaints are there, along with congressional testimony, issues briefings, items from the Center for National Security Studies, Morton Halperin, the ABA, and a couple of articles I wrote bundled with other coverage from National Journal (Shane Harris), MSNBC and USA Today.  There are also a couple of important Congressional Research Service reports as well.</p>
<p>File links are all filenames only (relative links), so you can download and unzip into any directory for local or lan use.</p>
<p>The collection is here:</p>
<p><a href="http://thewall.civiblog.org/rsf/nsa.html" rel="nofollow">thewall.civiblog.org/rsf/nsa.html</a></p>
<p>I hope You find this collection useful.</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
<p>  -dcm</p>
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		<title>By: TJ</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-149</link>
		<dc:creator>TJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Feb 2008 05:54:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-149</guid>
		<description>The potential law suits and legal fees stemming from possible lawsuits from private citizens suing for their potential rights under FISA would bankrupt these telecommunication companies. That would result in thousands having to find new work, destroying millions, if not billions, in investor value and potentially wreaking havoc on our telec. infrastructure. All that over something that their management team had understood was required of them to perform, by law, under the direction of the NSA.

Doesn&#039;t seem so clear cut to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The potential law suits and legal fees stemming from possible lawsuits from private citizens suing for their potential rights under FISA would bankrupt these telecommunication companies. That would result in thousands having to find new work, destroying millions, if not billions, in investor value and potentially wreaking havoc on our telec. infrastructure. All that over something that their management team had understood was required of them to perform, by law, under the direction of the NSA.</p>
<p>Doesn&#8217;t seem so clear cut to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-148</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Feb 2008 00:25:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-148</guid>
		<description>From &lt;a href=&quot;http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/white_house_keeps_beating_that.php#more&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Dana Perino today, 2/25/08&lt;/a&gt;:
&lt;blockquote&gt;The issue really right now between the House and the Senate, as far as I can tell, the biggest issue is retroactive liability protection, and in their op-ed they just had a passing glance to that issue. But it is one of the biggest sticking points, because at the end of the day if we don&#039;t have the companies helping us, then we won&#039;t have a program.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From <a href="http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/white_house_keeps_beating_that.php#more" rel="nofollow">Dana Perino today, 2/25/08</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>The issue really right now between the House and the Senate, as far as I can tell, the biggest issue is retroactive liability protection, and in their op-ed they just had a passing glance to that issue. But it is one of the biggest sticking points, because at the end of the day if we don&#8217;t have the companies helping us, then we won&#8217;t have a program.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: NIck Caleb</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-144</link>
		<dc:creator>NIck Caleb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2008 01:43:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-144</guid>
		<description>Well done, tL.  

I think that the word &quot;corporatocracy&quot; fits nicely here.  Or fascism, you feel like being a &quot;tin-foil-hat-wearer&quot;.  

The Bush administration has used state secrets privilege to cover up just about everything.  If that doesn&#039;t work, they just destroy documents like the CIA did with its torture tapes.  If people whistleblow, they are either silenced or jailed.  Even when individuals decide that they will take the punishment for whistleblowing in order to get information to the public, the press won&#039;t cover it!!!

See the Sibel Edmonds situation if you want to see a high profile example.

We&#039;ve got an institutional problem here, folks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well done, tL.  </p>
<p>I think that the word &#8220;corporatocracy&#8221; fits nicely here.  Or fascism, you feel like being a &#8220;tin-foil-hat-wearer&#8221;.  </p>
<p>The Bush administration has used state secrets privilege to cover up just about everything.  If that doesn&#8217;t work, they just destroy documents like the CIA did with its torture tapes.  If people whistleblow, they are either silenced or jailed.  Even when individuals decide that they will take the punishment for whistleblowing in order to get information to the public, the press won&#8217;t cover it!!!</p>
<p>See the Sibel Edmonds situation if you want to see a high profile example.</p>
<p>We&#8217;ve got an institutional problem here, folks.</p>
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		<title>By: johnd</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-139</link>
		<dc:creator>johnd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 23:26:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-139</guid>
		<description>Excellent article. Steve your comments re Ralph Nacchio are spot on. I have had cause to consider, from experience, who is responsible for watcthing the watchers. Governments and law enforcement generally have to apply to courts to secure warrants to gain access to the wire tapping capability that telco inherently possesses. Who do the telco&#039;s apply to?? And what busines advantage might that accrue, if abused? And who would ever know? And what are the consequences for a telco if one happend to acquire evidence of such actions?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent article. Steve your comments re Ralph Nacchio are spot on. I have had cause to consider, from experience, who is responsible for watcthing the watchers. Governments and law enforcement generally have to apply to courts to secure warrants to gain access to the wire tapping capability that telco inherently possesses. Who do the telco&#8217;s apply to?? And what busines advantage might that accrue, if abused? And who would ever know? And what are the consequences for a telco if one happend to acquire evidence of such actions?</p>
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		<title>By: Vic Hitler</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-138</link>
		<dc:creator>Vic Hitler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 17:34:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-138</guid>
		<description>Ve vass ONLY followink OR-durss!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ve vass ONLY followink OR-durss!</p>
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		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-137</link>
		<dc:creator>steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 16:15:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-137</guid>
		<description>Jeff D:&lt;i&gt;What did these companies get in return for breaking the law? That is the real question.&lt;/i&gt;

It appears &lt;a href=&quot;http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/22/129207&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;they were paid handsomely&lt;/a&gt;.  Comcast charged $1000 to begin a wiretap and $750 per month for each additional month.  Where I live, basic cable costs about $20/month- so ignoring the 4th amendment is apparently much better for the balance sheet.

And there are hints that it was a carrot-and-stick arrangement.  Ralph Nacchio, the CEO of the only major US telecom known to have refused to cooperate with the NSA&#039;s demands, was recently prosecuted by the USDOJ for insider trading.  In his trial, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/tech/article/0,2777,DRMN_23910_5719566,00.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Nacchio claimed that the prosecution was politically-driven retaliation&lt;/a&gt; against him and his company.  Nacchio&#039;s defense depended on classified documents that supposedly show the government targeted him because he stood up for his customer&#039;s privacy rights.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff D:<i>What did these companies get in return for breaking the law? That is the real question.</i></p>
<p>It appears <a href="http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/22/129207" rel="nofollow">they were paid handsomely</a>.  Comcast charged $1000 to begin a wiretap and $750 per month for each additional month.  Where I live, basic cable costs about $20/month- so ignoring the 4th amendment is apparently much better for the balance sheet.</p>
<p>And there are hints that it was a carrot-and-stick arrangement.  Ralph Nacchio, the CEO of the only major US telecom known to have refused to cooperate with the NSA&#8217;s demands, was recently prosecuted by the USDOJ for insider trading.  In his trial, <a href="http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/tech/article/0,2777,DRMN_23910_5719566,00.html" rel="nofollow">Nacchio claimed that the prosecution was politically-driven retaliation</a> against him and his company.  Nacchio&#8217;s defense depended on classified documents that supposedly show the government targeted him because he stood up for his customer&#8217;s privacy rights.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff D</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-136</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 15:20:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-136</guid>
		<description>I think the telecom companies should be sued for stupidity, for not standing up to the government.  They should have said &quot;no&quot; thats against the law.  What did these companies get in return for breaking the law?  That is the real question.  There should be no secrets, for they beget treason.  Anyone who thinks these actions are ok, has to leave the country.  Now here&#039;s the funny part, I think these actions show how malignant our government has become, so I am actively looking for another country to call home.  This country is a disgrace to humanity, we the people my keister!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the telecom companies should be sued for stupidity, for not standing up to the government.  They should have said &#8220;no&#8221; thats against the law.  What did these companies get in return for breaking the law?  That is the real question.  There should be no secrets, for they beget treason.  Anyone who thinks these actions are ok, has to leave the country.  Now here&#8217;s the funny part, I think these actions show how malignant our government has become, so I am actively looking for another country to call home.  This country is a disgrace to humanity, we the people my keister!!</p>
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		<title>By: Chris R.</title>
		<link>http://www.thelegality.com/2008/02/20/wiretapping-telecom-companies-and-you/comment-page-1/#comment-135</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 13:19:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelegality.com/archives/26#comment-135</guid>
		<description>WOW!  Now let&#039;s hope that our government does what is RIGHT and NOT grant retroactive immunity to these companies who have betrayed us and our rights.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WOW!  Now let&#8217;s hope that our government does what is RIGHT and NOT grant retroactive immunity to these companies who have betrayed us and our rights.</p>
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